Strengths On Fire

Bill Dippel (00:01.548)
Well, good morning, Sarah. How are you?

Sarah Collins (00:03.674)
Mr. Dippo, I'm doing great. How are you today?

Bill Dippel (00:07.402)
I am I have I'm still living the dream right now. I've got some great clients I've got some fun one of which we'll talk to a bit today. So but I'm I'm I'm Really fortunate in some of the the coaching stuff I've been doing lately and I know you and I talk offline quite a bit You're doing a lot of coaching on the outside, too So I just I just feel really lucky and fortunate that we get to do what we do and watch people get better At who they are and how they behave, right?

Sarah Collins (00:16.953)
Excellent.

Sarah Collins (00:35.128)
Yeah, it's great work. Very fulfilling.

Bill Dippel (00:37.174)
Seem reasonable. Yeah. Yeah. It makes for a, it makes for a really good, a good tagline. I mentioned that tagline, I think twice at a networking event I was at yesterday where I said, you know, I get to, my job is to watch people get better at what they do and help them get there. And I think the couple of times I mentioned it, they were like, that's a great job. Right. It was a, you know, some of them were insurance brokers. Some of them were

Sarah Collins (00:53.262)
Mm-hmm.

Sarah Collins (00:59.543)
Yeah.

Bill Dippel (01:04.194)
were vendors and stuff and they were like, wow, that's actually a really good way to say what a good job, what, what, what a good job would look like, right? How that, how that looks and feels. So I was, I was kind of proud of that one. So, but anyway, I'm going to ask you a different question to get you kicked off today. You ready? So my question for you today is, can you, because we're talking about our business and our coaching and how we jump in.

Sarah Collins (01:21.25)
Alright.

Bill Dippel (01:31.608)
Can you talk to me about a shift you've made in your business this year that's had a big impact?

Sarah Collins (01:39.418)
Yeah, I think, you know, I am a real loosey goosey business owner entrepreneur over here because never wanted to be, I never wanted to my own business. Are you kidding me? What the heck am I doing? yeah, right. Woo, what's happening over here? And I think it's always figuring out the best way to do things. And because I,

Bill Dippel (01:46.178)
No,

Sarah Collins (02:03.054)
I mean, we know my themes like high positivity, high woo, right? I have got a ranger is my, a ranger and responsibility are my only purples. Input is my only green. So she's a real loose cannon over here. I just say all that to preface of like, I don't really have a plan. Like sometimes people say to me like, what's in your business plan? What business plan? I don't have a business plan. These crazies.

Bill Dippel (02:17.038)
She is.

Sarah Collins (02:30.904)
So what I say, don't do, don't mimic what I'm doing, okay? But I go back and forth between the spread of coaching, one-on-one coaching and facilitating. Now I feel like my talents really make me an excellent facilitator. I love being in a group of people. I love keynote speaking. And that's one of the pivots I'm making this year is I'm going to be doing more keynote speaking because I love coming in fresh. I love being a

big burst of energy, getting people excited. I'm a great kickoff gal, okay? But I also love when I work with a client and they've signed on for months, years to work with me, incorporating coaching with them and really pushing them to do it internally.

Bill Dippel (03:05.132)
Yeah. Yeah.

Sarah Collins (03:22.478)
So I personally don't take a ton of one-off one-on-one coaching clients where I'm just working with them. I know a ton of strengths coaches do that. I know a lot of coaches that's their bread and butter and I love that they do it. Like that's what you should do. But personally, I do most of my coaching now internally and it's telling my clients right at the top. I would say this year I've gotten even more intentional to say if you want to see the real impact of this, not only is it the team sessions we're going to do together,

but it's the one-on-ones, it's the partnership coaching, it's the coaching embedded into it because people just need time with the coach to grasp their strengths and their personal situations and the partnership coaching of how do we work together better. So I think I've just been doing a better job of packaging bigger packages that combine facilitation and coaching to move the needle for people.

Bill Dippel (04:18.318)
I dunno.

Sarah Collins (04:20.494)
How about you, Mr. Dipple?

Bill Dippel (04:20.854)
Nice. Well, I would a subtle spin on yours. I have for years worked with a previous guest on our show, Ali Alden, about how I promote, how I do what I do. And I would say similar to you and sharpening what you offer or maybe understanding where you go. That's where I'm going with this in that she's created documents for me and and specific.

media and ways that I promote our coaching and working with groups and My understanding and usage of those I again all blue relationship II so Lucy goosey as you would say in the beginning So I'm not certain why any client signed up with me for three or four years Total apology to our current guest here today. Who's I think you guys have been with me about three years, right? Three three and a half Yeah

Sarah Collins (05:03.566)
Mm-hmm.

Token Barnthouse (05:16.624)
Just thinking about that bill. It's about three years now.

Bill Dippel (05:18.838)
So I don't know how they fell into the trap of the loosey-goosey seemed to make the most sense, but I am much better at signifying how long this process will take, showing you the roadmap document, presenting it correctly to the C-suite or to the HR groups, understanding where we can make those bigger differences. And a big part of that is because of one of the companies that...

the guests that we have today because I got to practice that ideal and make sure that we knew what meant the most for each of those departments within the business we're stepping into. so I think in that way, I've literally looked at some of our materials and went, oh, that's brilliant. That's why we built that. When it was done two years ago, I looked at it and went, yeah, I'm sure I can use this. I'll figure out how. And now,

Sarah Collins (06:11.215)
Mm-hmm.

Bill Dippel (06:13.076)
and reflection and coming back to it, I'd say the big change is now I absolutely see why when we built that together, it made sense and now how I can absolutely use it. So it's coming back full circle, being a realization, sharpening how we do it. And I think you and I are saying the same thing. And we want to be as sharp and as competent with our people as we can be. You want to provide the best process and project you can. I want to do that as well, whether I'm keynoteing.

Sarah Collins (06:23.898)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (06:35.663)
Right.

Bill Dippel (06:41.9)
whether it's some single smaller events that we're just getting people moving or whether as we say, it's a three to four year, dig in to, start building it. And I want to make sure I'm laser focused on what they need and how I'm promoting that accurately to them. And I don't think I've been great at that for a couple of years. And then the last year, year and half, maybe two, I've become much more focused on it.

Sarah Collins (06:59.225)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (07:08.27)
Yeah, you know what would help us be really good at that? A lot of Achiever, which I do not have. Don't even have, wish I have. It might be most strengths envious about that Achiever theme because if I had that man, what would I be doing right now? And that's what we get to talk about today. Today we are talking about is, are we overhyping Achiever? Which like I am, I often overhype Achiever because I don't have it and I have strengths envy. so...

Bill Dippel (07:28.814)
Mmm.

Sarah Collins (07:35.46)
We've got an excellent guest here today who's going to help us explore because he's got a Jiva at number three. Hi token.

Bill Dippel (07:41.932)
He does.

Token Barnthouse (07:43.359)
Hi Sarah. Hi, Bill.

Bill Dippel (07:44.767)
Hey token great to have you on the show today. Can you can you talk a little bit about where you're at what you do and Maybe hit us with your top 10. Let us know what those are so that as we're going through today people can hear listen for the clues on those on those top 10

Token Barnthouse (08:01.352)
Excellent. My name is Token Barthaus. I'm currently the Special Projects Manager and Assistant to the Chief Executive Officer and President at the Food Bank of Northern Nevada. Been here for just over two and a half years and I'm just thriving and loving this role and just part of an incredible team. A sad mission that we serve, but an incredible mission with just...

Incredible examples of impact daily. So just a pleasure to be a part of this team. My top 10 strengths in order are learner, responsibility, achiever, relator, intellection, input, belief, individualization, arranger, and connectedness. And I am solidly in the green zone. I'm in strategic thinking.

Bill Dippel (08:47.982)
Nice. Nice.

Bill Dippel (08:54.19)
Cool.

Sarah Collins (08:54.266)
Strategic thinker with a lot of executing things up in there, too

Token Barnthouse (08:55.763)
Again?

Bill Dippel (08:58.626)
Yeah, do you find that your strategic thinking is definitely what guides you? Do you feel it when you read this report? Was that what really resonated with you was that that learner in election input all that green at the top? Or do you really feel like that achiever something that kicks in really hard for you?

Token Barnthouse (08:58.921)
Yeah.

Token Barnthouse (09:17.501)
think I had the initial response that many people who maybe have never done a strengths assessment have, which was this thing nailed me to the T. yeah, I won't say it validated how I am, but it just really made me think into, wow, how?

Sarah Collins (09:32.602)
Mmm.

Token Barnthouse (09:46.399)
How have I not known these things? You kind of take a little bit of that for granted and then kind of peeling it apart and like, wow, I understand a little bit better now why I like taking on different projects, why I really dive in and really need to have the facts and the context to organize and to arrange what I'm doing.

Bill Dippel (10:09.346)
Yeah.

Token Barnthouse (10:10.239)
funny thing is I get a little bit loosey goosey outside of things. have two very active school aged children and an incredible partner in crime and my wife who is very busy and active and things. So some of these top 10, they never go to rest. It's pretty amazing how it just nailed it. That's what I go back to. I've done all the different assessments and

Sarah Collins (10:28.26)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (10:34.692)
Yeah.

Token Barnthouse (10:40.029)
this is and that's through different roles and different organizations. But as we came online with Bill, the thing I loved so much about this is it's great that we've done this assessment. Now we're doing something with it. We use this at our food bank. As I know, my colleague, Karen Singer, has detailed a little bit previously here on the podcast. This is the real deal. We are invested in this.

This affects how we operate. It impacts it positively how we interact with one another, how we assign work, how we look at the ideal individuals for different key positions we fill, the projects we get into, and it's part of our culture. We're very proud of it.

Bill Dippel (11:26.235)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (11:26.34)
Yeah, that's so great to hear. And I'm so glad that you've got Bill there to help you steer the ship and guide you through that process. You know, today we get to talk about achiever. Now I always describe achievers as the people who want to get stuff done. They're the list makers, whether it's a physical list or a mental to do list, but they sort of start every day at zero and kind of stack up how much they can get done.

Token Barnthouse (11:33.363)
KS.

Sarah Collins (11:50.586)
I find them often to be some of the most productive, most high achieving individuals on teams. And I feel comfortable making that large assumption and saying that out loud because it's almost always true, especially like you, where you've got responsibility in your top 10 as well. So I find especially my high achieving, high responsibility people, they're high achievers.

But I'm interested, token, how do you see Achiever show up for you? What does it look like? Because for every person, every strength shows up a little bit different. So I know in general a little bit about all 34. I don't know you, so I'm curious. Give us your take on what Achiever looks like.

Token Barnthouse (12:34.163)
Fever to me is that organization.

day before the feet hit the floor. was like, what are my responsibilities to do? What are the things that I must be a part of? Where are there individuals in my life that are relying on me? And that's at home and work. And just putting that plan together. It sounds silly, but that keeps things organized.

Bill Dippel (13:07.426)
Yeah, yeah.

Token Barnthouse (13:08.127)
It really does. that where does that come from? This is what I've been thinking about when you asked me about this topic. I think that comes just from coming from a very organized background and lifestyle. Bill mentioned a military background. I'm a Navy brat. My mom's a retired Navy chief, was very, very proud of the service and she's had to our country.

Even more proud of the way that affected my family, two younger brothers and a dad who also served in the Navy. And we got to travel the world and experience some amazing things. But to have the embedded discipline that is required to be productive in a military setting was certainly in my house. And I had over a 22 year period, had a career as a Navy civilian.

from leading small teams to having a department with about 400 folks in my last job as I wrapped up that career and started this chapter across several departments. So, you know, in those departments, eight departments, foreign employees, eight distinct siloed departments with seven degrees of separation between myself and frontline employees. If you're not organized and you don't have your message clear and you're not,

hyper-focused. You lose your why. You lose your how. And when you lose your how and your why, things just start to crumble.

That might be really excessive, but just think about that. If you don't have things dialed into, this is how you do this task. And you're not training individuals and they don't know the expectations on their performance. You're not looking for their feedback. Those are critical things. and in that instance,

Bill Dippel (15:02.52)
Yeah.

Token Barnthouse (15:07.081)
That was a different kind of achiever. That's when you are a single point of contact representing many people, that's attention to detail. If it's lost, you don't achieve. You don't. It really comes down to, I think, an individual's knowledge of their purpose, knowing how, and then being supported to dive in and to execute.

Sarah Collins (15:33.626)
Yeah.

Bill Dippel (15:36.483)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (15:36.568)
I have to believe that I'm hearing some of your belief in connectedness come through in that as well. Do you think that that echoes in there and how you see that show up?

Token Barnthouse (15:41.823)
Yes.

Token Barnthouse (15:46.515)
Very much, very much so.

Sarah Collins (15:48.558)
Yeah, which is a true testament. This is why every strength looks a little different for every person because you have other strengths around it and other life experiences. Like you said, you come from this military background, which obviously has had a huge impact being part of growing up with parents and then being in it yourself. That's impacting you. Plus these talents that you have, you can hear how it influences this achiever and how you get things done and really talking about kind of like that value space and that why and that purpose.

I love hearing you acknowledge the importance of expectations for others so they can also be achieving the things. Do you think that your achiever has a really high bar for what other people should be achieving?

Token Barnthouse (16:36.911)
Yes, absolutely. And as much as I say, you point a finger at somebody, you've got three pointing right back at you. So there's that sense of accountability to self that comes with that. But yes, I have a high expectation for myself on my achievements.

Sarah Collins (16:44.334)
Mm-hmm.

Sarah Collins (16:55.043)
Yeah?

Token Barnthouse (16:59.327)
And I do have an inherent expectation about the individuals around me for those who I report to and those who would report to me. I have that same expectation. Be that fair or not, that is, is great.

Sarah Collins (17:11.938)
Yeah, yeah. I was just going to ask you, is that fair? That's what I was going to say. Exactly, Token, was going to say, and is that fair to do in the spirit of the debate, right? Of like these achievers come in with, I always say, achiever plus achiever responsibility. They, if we have capacity of productivity, one to 10, I always say, my achievers want to get as close to 10 as possible. And I'm always pushing them down.

Token Barnthouse (17:23.965)
Well, wait.

Sarah Collins (17:39.864)
Like, okay, try to sit at eight and a half. I know you can do 10. And here's the thing that these folks need to know. Your 10 is my 15. So even if you're at an eight and a half, you're over my scale of what I can even do at my very, very best. So it's like, what you can do is it's extreme. I mean, it's a talent for a reason. So it's like, then thinking this is something that you hold and you value and you're so good at, is it fair to put that upon other people sometimes when we're expecting a lot of them?

Token Barnthouse (18:12.799)
I'm going to take the easy route and say it depends. that depends. But it truly depends on the role and the function that they have in the organization or the relationship where that impacts. Is it fair? it equitable? Probably not in a lot of instances. So you have to temper that. So earlier this year, I turned 50.

Sarah Collins (18:15.884)
It depends. Okay, tell me more.

Sarah Collins (18:30.105)
Mm-hmm.

Sarah Collins (18:38.505)
my gosh.

Token Barnthouse (18:38.553)
So, and changing my career path and then turning 50, it's been cause for me to maybe take the foot off the gas pedal a little bit and say, hey, yes, things are being achieved, but what's actually being accomplished? What's the bigger picture? And I think there's a distinction between those two pools of thought there with those words. It's great. I'm checking boxes. I'm checking boxes, but what has...

Sarah Collins (18:52.762)
oooo

Sarah Collins (19:02.926)
I love that.

Token Barnthouse (19:07.241)
been accomplished. If I'm checking boxes, great. But at the end, what have I done? If I'm running myself personally into the ground, what am I actually doing?

Sarah Collins (19:20.526)
Yeah, that distinction between achieving and accomplishing. And I think that achievers can get that, right? They can get that, okay, I just need to be busy. And they will prioritize busyness over almost anything at times. And so then it's like, to what end? To what end? Why? Okay, so you ran yourself into the ground all day and now you're exhausted and grumpy with everyone around you because you've been working.

Token Barnthouse (19:31.7)
Mm-hmm.

Sarah Collins (19:47.384)
And what was the point of all of that? Did you actually accomplish what your goals were? Which makes me think going back to your why, what's the point of all of this? Would you say that now you have belief in connectedness, so I don't know where this comes in for you, but have you always had the guiding compass of the why? Or is that something that you were able to kind of zone in on and accept later on in your career?

Token Barnthouse (20:14.995)
I don't think this answer will surprise you. At times where I've strayed, it's been probably the most stressful times in work and personal life. And when I really kept that North Star, when I really kept on track, it's thriving.

Bill Dippel (20:31.916)
Yeah, yeah, well you brought up the need for organization particularly because of your role and the people that the the strata of the people that you work with and Sarah's bringing up is it fair or unfair to have Expectations on how other people achieve in your realm

Those both tie directly into something I admire about you, but I want to hear your thoughts on and that is token has stepped into the role of ambassador at Food Bank and does a lot of the a lot of the I guess upfront strengths work with some of the new employees. So for our listeners that maybe haven't heard the way we talk about ambassadorships early on, we for larger companies, we will often empower.

a couple of very, I guess, strengths aware people that have gone through it and really like what that is, how that comes to play for them and what they can see in it. And we empower them with some of the added coaching tools that we use that allow them to make a difference for more and more people within the company. Because as outside coaches, I can't be there every day. I don't know what has changed or what has happened. And there needs to be somebody for

a large group like this that can that there's somebody that people can come to and say I'm having this issue or I you know in my strengths I feel like I'm falling in this and we can't always be there so we've empowered some ambassadors token you fulfill that role and I'm curious we provide you the the Initialization folders that we do for all of your people that are in the color of your domains and have all of that information when you're going over that initial information with your

employees? Are you finding one that they're also feeling that, this really nailed me? Is that happening for you when you go over that with them? And secondly, is it fulfilling the organization need or sometimes are you expecting as your achiever would expecting them to go on to it more or maybe less than they do? And then you're maybe let down in some way. So there's a couple of questions in there, right? Organizational achiever, right?

Bill Dippel (22:52.558)
Do you think they bond to it as well?

Token Barnthouse (22:56.041)
So first, have my 100 % the experiences when folks open that binder and they look through what their top 10 are and they get stuck. wow.

Several, several of our most recent folks that have completed the assessment and gone through and just they're amazed. Again, like myself, they've done all the rating and scoring assessments out there and they're excited that there's something out there that nails them and it just draws them into that information more to figure out how that happened.

And then as the ambassador in that session, we get to look at the why and then, okay, what do we do with that now? And how are we using that as an organization to better know individuals and bring them into the quilt of who we are?

Token Barnthouse (23:59.786)
tempered expectations on the achiever side, because there are some folks that actually do get the time to think and contemplate on what that top 10 knows in the assessment. We do have some individuals that don't, just the nature of their job. They come here and they grind it out. They're on the road. We've got drivers and warehouse techs and a lot of blue collar type labor that we...

We have to go about that a little bit differently when it comes to engaging in that conversation and making it meaningful and keeping it fun.

Bill Dippel (24:37.646)
Yeah, yeah. And so you found that there are times you're walking into those sessions and Sarah curious from a coaching point of view. I know I do this. I walk into certain coaching sessions looking at a set of themes and assume I know how this is going to go. I have a feeling on this and achievers very low for me. It's number 28 for me, Sarah. It's 22 for you. So for us, it's not achiever that that hits that.

Token Barnthouse (24:42.215)
Thank you.

Token Barnthouse (24:50.085)
Thank you.

Thank you.

Bill Dippel (25:06.634)
It's easy for me to peel back and then lean into my relationship to go wow that went in a totally different direction than I thought it was going to go. So let's dive into that. How is that possible from an achiever point of view? Do you set that expectation walking in and when that employee doesn't lean into it or doesn't bond to a certain part of it or goes in a completely different direction? Do you have trouble pivoting away from how that how that

makes you feel and what it means to that employee.

Bill Dippel (25:47.169)
I know it's a long one. It's a it's a it's it's something from the coaching point of view that I mean, I feel it frequently, right? I gotta I gotta make sure I can pivot and move but achievers, they aren't always super great at that pivot. So you think that that pivoting for you is something that that you struggle with? Or do you actually find that achieving and just making sure it means the most of them makes it easy for you to pivot?

Sarah Collins (26:17.1)
It's tough, isn't it? He's surrounding his big tough question at you.

Bill Dippel (26:20.63)
I know I'm throwing them a hard one. I really am.

Token Barnthouse (26:25.977)
I do have a background in some facilitation with management and leadership classes and customer service. And there are multiple pivots required to have something black and white on a piece of paper, multiple colored, if you will. Or you're in the middle of an active engagement and attempting to draw personal stories and reflection on things.

You have to come into something like that with an open mindset and clear goal in what you're attempting to achieve. The achievement portion isn't necessarily we're going to get through this page, we're going to flip to the next one, we're going to get through this page. It is a level of comfort with the material. It's a personal level of comfort with.

with what that individual, with that group of individuals has in front of them. It's the first time for many of them they've ever done anything like this. So in the middle of doing this.

Bill, I remember this when I had my introduction session with you. I was consuming that information at the same time that I was actively participating. So it's your mind as you're going right brain, left brain in the middle and you're nodding and making the facilitator happy because if you're like me as a facilitator, the folks that are quiet are not safe. Yes.

Bill Dippel (27:53.038)
It's a good point.

Token Barnthouse (27:57.597)
The achieve part of this is you have to adjust that. Now, you also look at different groups. When I'm in a small group and someone who has already been through that introduction to it, they can get a little bit deeper and you can set that expectation and tell them what, this is what success is gonna look like today. This is what the result will be. This is where we're get together.

Sarah Collins (28:22.404)
Yeah. I have a different question to take this in a different direction to think about as a society, as a culture, how we look at Achiever.

Do you think that as, especially if we think about the US culture, if we think about in the United States, do we celebrate achievers too much because of this hustle culture? Are we saying, and have you experienced this in your life token, like, you know what? Awesome, good job. I mean, I find that a lot of achievers have gotten praise for their achievements since early childhood.

because I see that we like that. So I'm curious from someone who is an achiever, do you think that we are constantly celebrating achiever because of this hustle culture, go do more, more, more? And then what are the consequences of that?

Token Barnthouse (29:18.847)
Great question. You might be looking at one of those results of one of those kids. I have, I'm looking in my office. If I could turn this, I could show you some of that. I think the easy answer to that is yes. And my experience is as I was moving around as a military kid, I absolutely, I was participating in sports. I was participating in things and yes, there were.

Bill Dippel (29:23.502)
Ha

Token Barnthouse (29:47.645)
You get this, you do well, you get a ribbon, you get a medal, you do well in school, you get the honor roll certificate, you continue that on, you continue that trend. Those who get things done are often afforded opportunities to do more things on top of what you're already doing. that does, that turns into, okay, I got this accomplished, I have a little more time, so I could probably do a little bit more.

And I could do a little bit more and you get the thank you, you get the trinket, the item that continues to push. You get the public praise, you get the accolades, you have a resume or a vita that is just full of things you've accomplished and done you've achieved, sorry. But.

Sarah Collins (30:22.159)
Yeah.

Token Barnthouse (30:37.459)
Yeah, so absolutely our society is hyped on that. Because if you're not doing that, then what are you doing?

Sarah Collins (30:43.854)
Right.

And it's interesting if we compare that to like a European culture. I mean, we don't have anyone here from Europe. I don't think, right? None of us, none of you are from Europe, but I feel like what I... Okay, good. So maybe you can speak to this.

Token Barnthouse (30:49.777)
Thank you.

Token Barnthouse (30:54.047)
I spent a lot of my time growing up there. So I will say, and out of local cultures, and I will say, Sarah, that it's quite different. The more you're getting into a part of a system and you're developing within the system and the achievement and the accomplishment is pushing through and being a part of a system, not so much peaks and valleys along the way that you have. That's a big generalization, of course.

Quite different. Quite different. I see that as I mentioned before, two school-age kids, they're high achievers. They're both in high-level travel club sports. They are both crushing it in the classroom and getting those certificates and do that. I tell them all the time. I am not proud of them because of

the accolade or the trophy or the medal or their certificate. I'm proud of them for that drive they have and the fact that they have found things they love and they're putting their talents and time into it. At very young ages, it's easy to support them. But at the same time, around families and others that we're watching, it is win, win, win, achieve, achieve at all costs.

Sarah Collins (32:00.506)
Mm-hmm.

Sarah Collins (32:13.562)
Mm-hmm.

Token Barnthouse (32:17.221)
at the risk of physical harm and at the risk of, you know, I would say losing that way. I was blessed. I grew up in a household with two parents that fully supported me and my two younger brothers. And our focus was on who we were going to be as individuals. wasn't them living vicariously through us. And I think that that is so critical.

Sarah Collins (32:24.335)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (32:44.43)
Yeah. Yeah, it really makes me think I like how you brought up the thing about your kids and even your experience as a kid, because I do think that we right now in the United States have a real problem with pushing the kids into a hustle, hustle culture and really taking people who have high achievers and making it all about that. And what we are finding is young people are more depressed, have higher anxiety, we have higher

depression and suicide rates in our young people more now than ever. And a lot of the research I have read is because we cannot let them rest. It is go to this activity, go to this class, take this extra thing, do more, do more, do more. And to me, I do think if I'm just gonna be out here and get myself on a limb that we do over hype achiever in the United States. And we say, yes, you can do it, do more. And like you said, once you start doing more, people are like, this is awesome. Now you can do even more.

And we're starting to do this younger and younger and we're breaking our people. And I think we all have to go back to what is the purpose of being here on this earth, in this world? Is it to get as much done as possible? Is it to have as much on your resume as possible? Or is it to live a fulfilling, beautiful, healthy, loving life with the people around you? And how does achievement fit into that?

I always tell people I view the Clifton strength as muscles. So like, you know, it's innate. So when you're born, I think your top strengths come out just as bigger muscles. So they take less to get them kind of working. And then if you went like down to 34, the muscles get smaller and smaller, which is why if you try to do something at the bottom of your list, it's so exhausting because you got to work that little muscle so much to get it any girth to it. But what I see with Achiever is if that's in your top 10, top five, it's come out as a big muscle. And from birth,

your parents and your teachers and your coaches are like, go, go, go, go. And then it gets this, be this huge rock hard muscle and it sits in the driver's seat every single day. And then it's just a detriment. You can't even get it out of the driver's seat because it's just swollen. Cause that's all you've given attention to. So now you've got all these other talents you've been neglecting. And this one is getting into a huge dumpster fire because you're just using it constantly. And like you were saying, and if it's not focused on why,

Sarah Collins (35:03.322)
To what end? Yes, you're good at doing things, but to what end? It can really, I think, get in people's way and cause like a backslide almost even. I mean, what happens to people when their achiever is too much? What do we see happen to those folks?

Token Barnthouse (35:22.719)
out. There you go. One of my last two NOA 34 themes is empathy.

Bill Dippel (35:24.46)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (35:25.112)
Yeah, they get burnt out?

Sarah Collins (35:31.513)
Mm-hmm

Token Barnthouse (35:34.911)
It's just, and there you go. Like, hey, you know, I was able to do this. I don't know what your problem is. What are you doing? Well, maybe you've got a better balance over here.

Sarah Collins (35:40.6)
Right?

Sarah Collins (35:46.936)
Yeah.

Token Barnthouse (35:47.441)
I don't. I didn't.

Sarah Collins (35:49.636)
Yeah.

Bill Dippel (35:50.103)
Well said having the empathy down low. We don't coach towards the bottom of these reports, but not having the empathy and then stepping into the idea of achiever and responsibility and burning out, holding others accountable and saying, I don't feel like you've put in, right? I don't understand where you came from because my, what I've achieved and what, what I'm responsible for makes me feel that you should be under those same guidelines and

that empathy being at the very, you know, very, almost the very bottom for you. I can see where that makes that tough. I'm really glad you brought that up because that's a really unique way to see that. Right. And to say, you know, I do need sometimes the responsibility I need to have is with the person in front of me. It isn't to achieve the goal. So I need to flip that idea around a little bit. And I think you've been very successful at doing that at Food Bank and

stepping into the ambassadorship and the management role that I know you do frequently you and I have talked or and I've seen you flip that responsibility around to say I need to be responsible in this moment and be really present and that's what I need more than I'm thinking the big picture the idea the responsibility outside of these doors right now and you need to fulfill that need whether I can accurately give it to you or not

And I think you're very successful at flipping that responsibility note around and as well as the achiever, right? I think those play together really heavily and I Sarah I'm kind of with you because I don't possess it. I think we're over hyping achiever I think it gets on a lot of people's way But when I see token using it in a pretty mature

I guess fruitful way with the people around him that achiever and that responsibility focusing on what's right in front of you instead of the big idea. I think sometimes I see a really, a much better picture of it, but I do think we do suffer from the overhyping of it from time to time.

Sarah Collins (38:00.026)
Yeah, I find that often I don't I would say if I were to say I'm coaching against Achiever that might be too much. But I oftentimes coaching with Achiever to see how do we use it in a smarter way. Because I do see it take over people's life. I mean, sometimes in an initial deep dive strengths coaching conversation.

it is often my high achievers that end up crying in the session. And also we're doing in the session is talking about their career and talking about how they use their strengths. But they're this rubber band that's pulled so tight of doing, doing, doing, doing, doing that when I say, hey, we're going to pause for an hour and just talk about you and how you do things, it's emotionally loaded because they're so close to that burnout line. You know, and that makes me sad. That makes me sad because I have

Achiever envy because I don't have this and I'm like, wow, you guys do so much. This is like really cool. I'm like really jealous how much you can get done. But I also see it from a coaching standpoint of again, kind of coaching against it or coaching with it in a way to think about how do we pull back to lean on other things because it just gets so overutilized. It's the one if someone has it in their top 10, they're using it like their number one almost always.

Bill Dippel (38:59.222)
I don't either.

Bill Dippel (39:05.23)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (39:23.512)
I almost never meet someone who has Achiever in their top 10 and they're like, yeah, that one I barely use. They're always like, yes, more, let's go. And, you know, we just have to think about, mean, Bill, I'd be curious for you and even Token with what you do in your ambassador program, do you find that you're like, okay, how do we take the foot off the gas pedal on Achiever and add in other things more than trying to build it up?

Token Barnthouse (39:52.379)
I would just say that yes, I've said the word temper a little bit. It's OK, this is quality over quantity. So really focus in on best representing that skill set I have and the perspectives that I have. And those are appreciated traits far more than just the sheer number of things getting done.

Sarah Collins (40:18.02)
Yeah.

Token Barnthouse (40:19.215)
And it just really, really depends on the situation you're in. have been that guy who never takes a break. And when an intentional pause is taken in a group, yeah, it's easy to get emotional when you don't take that time for self care and that time to just really pause. You're like, yeah, wow, I'm right at the edge of...

Sarah Collins (40:46.394)
Hmm.

Bill Dippel (40:47.34)
Where I'm at? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And Sarah, you keep.

Token Barnthouse (40:48.543)
We're gonna burn it out like here I am. You don't realize it because you are, you're that rubber band. I have on a board in my office, I have had this probably for two decades. It's just a rubber band on a push pin. And I put it there to remind myself to not be useless because a rubber band that's just sitting there not holding anything is just taking up space.

Sarah Collins (40:50.82)
Yeah.

Token Barnthouse (41:15.783)
So that's how engrained Achiever is. Don't be a loose rubber band, right? That rubber band has capacity, but don't push it. Because when it snaps, you don't put a rubber band back together.

Sarah Collins (41:18.65)
was like, wow, is there a better metaphor for achiever?

Bill Dippel (41:23.214)
I'm getting my push pin out right now. That's really good.

Sarah Collins (41:31.481)
Yeah, but.

Yeah, then we throw it away. When the rubber band snaps, you just throw it in the trash. So don't let yourself snap.

Token Barnthouse (41:36.607)
Thanks for all the work.

Token Barnthouse (41:40.649)
Yeah.

Bill Dippel (41:41.177)
Yeah, great, great metaphor. I also we brought up how your responsibility plays it at work so hard. I will tell you that there are many times I communicate directly with Token regarding upcoming sessions, things we're doing within his within his groups because I rely on his responsibility, because I rely on his on his achiever. How

Can I give him some information that I know will help the people that he's about to work with? I provide, like I said, the folders that get everybody up and up to speed and moving on this. How can I lean into your achiever better? And how can I make sure what I'm putting in that folder gets you to be able to to feel the fuel of achiever and and responsibility in that way, too, because.

If I'm giving you the right tools in that you have so it's such a fertile playground of being able to promote and talk about what's happening and how you can make the difference for those people in that room. So to that, I would tell you, I really appreciate your achiever. It really means a lot to me because it makes my job so much easier knowing who I can lean into and how I can step towards that.

Sarah Collins (43:02.788)
Well, and I think that's what a lot of leaders feel. Leaders feel, Bill. And that's where I think we have to be really thoughtful leaders, partners, collaborators when we're working with achievers because yes, they can do it. And yes, we love that. We love that we can trust them and we know that they'll get it done. But we have to be aware of when am I asking too much? Because I think more often than not, an achiever's never going to say enough is enough.

They're just going to say, yes, I can do it because the truth is they usually can do it. The question we have to be asking is, should they be doing it?

Bill Dippel (43:39.555)
Right, right token you're probably hearing so much of the stuff you and I have worked on when when you hear Sarah saying this because we have With that group and with the achiever and so many of the people that we work with at food bank that are achievers We've hit that line many times. We need to from the outside think about hey, I'm gonna ask you to do this but What else should we not be doing at that point? We need to be thinking about some plate

Token Barnthouse (43:41.385)
So.

Bill Dippel (44:09.566)
coaching or some plate responsibility of what I can take off and what I need to put on So we've worked on that with token as well as with many of the people within his his area But token on your end. I want to ask you this part because we've also worked together on We don't just turn this off at the end of the day and go home and we're totally someone different our themes become completely You know dysfunctional and something else takes over

You brought up your children in sports and things that they're doing. How do you think your achiever has washed over your children or their sports world or maybe something on the personal side where, hey, I've need to tone that back or ramp it up. How might that have played out for you?

Token Barnthouse (44:59.487)
Great question. As conversation I actually have had with my daughters, 15 turning 16 here in a few months, who is hyper-focused on going to college to play sports. Because I did. Because in the closet hanging up, I've got my high school letter jacket with eight varsity letters and captain pins, and I've got a varsity letter jacket from Indiana University. The real big red, Sarah. And so...

Sarah Collins (45:24.418)
No.

Bill Dippel (45:25.187)
no, it just came up. There it is.

Token Barnthouse (45:28.435)
There it is, there it is. So my kids see that and I'm proud of it. But that's another chapter of my life. And I love seeing them being active and physically thriving, but also being leaders on their teams and intellectually thriving. So it's creating that balance.

and letting them know first and foremost they are the own individuals. They should never compare themselves to another teammate or me as an accomplishment, much like I share that my parents never did that with me. None of these things are crammed down their throats and to our

best ability, my wife and I are not overfilling calendars and throwing expectations on them. It's really working on them to get to what their why is. Why do they want to do this? And then when they find it and when they set that level, that bar of where they want to be, then we help them stay there.

Sarah Collins (46:25.711)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (46:33.08)
Yeah.

Token Barnthouse (46:34.054)
And it's putting them in situations with organizations that have caring adults and support structures around them. It's being fully engaged in the process and controlling where they are as much as we can for the handful of years we have them left in our house.

Sarah Collins (46:52.312)
Yeah, you can hear your relationship building themes and maybe even that responsibility that you have as a parent really shift and almost quiet down that achiever when it comes to the parenting role that you fulfill.

Token Barnthouse (46:58.271)
Yeah, I don't think it would be fair. I don't think it's fair to do that to someone.

Sarah Collins (47:10.488)
Yeah.

Bill Dippel (47:10.774)
I hear that individualization is number eight when you're talking about, want to talk to you about why you want this as an individual. Where, where is it that you, why do you want to do this? What's the point for you and not for me? Right. I hear that individual side that you really spot them as unique and creative entities that can step into their own light. Right. You don't need to provide that. So,

Token Barnthouse (47:15.401)
you

Token Barnthouse (47:30.59)
Thanks.

Thank

Token Barnthouse (47:37.245)
So.

Sarah Collins (47:38.2)
And it just, yeah, that just goes to show how important it is to lean on some of your other themes when you have that high achiever that you don't always have to have it be out front. There can be other things that take precedent. and so it's thinking maybe even for the audience, thinking through, if you have that high achiever, where does it really run and where does it find places to step back and allow somebody else to take the driver's seat? And, if you struggle with that achiever running out in front in certain arenas like work,

Token Barnthouse (47:46.023)
It's on me.

Sarah Collins (48:08.046)
where I think it does a lot. Are there ways to mimic some of what you have in other areas that tamper it down in those areas where it's running forward? So you can have some of that balance in your life and that ability to understand your real why and work towards outcomes, not just check boxes.

I asked the LinkedIn audience, what's your honest take on Achiever? And we have 6 % said love it, can't stop, won't stop. And 6 % also said overrated to be honest. And then 88%. So majority of people said good, but needs boundaries. And I think anything from this conversation you could take away is that is what we were saying is that all strengths are good.

Bill Dippel (48:36.428)
Yes. What was their answer, sir?

Bill Dippel (48:58.648)
Hahaha

Sarah Collins (49:00.378)
This is based in positive psychology. There is no bad strength. Achiever isn't a phenomenal strength, but it does need boundaries. Otherwise it can get too strong. We had some really good comments too. Andy Chester said, Achiever is such a powerful talent. It's the engine that keeps people moving forward. But as a coach, I often see clients struggle when they don't give themselves permission.

to rest or celebrate what they've already accomplished.

Right? And so he also added on there, helping achievers redefine success beyond the to-do list is one of the most meaningful shifts we can guide. I think that is representative in this conversation we're having here. We also have Katie Christensen, who's been on the pod said, it's a powerful driver. And because it's so common, it's motivation tends to be more well understood.

Bill Dippel (49:33.102)
Smart. Smart.

Sarah Collins (49:59.222)
and accurately interpreted by the general population than a theme like command or context, which I think is true. I think it's the number one theme in the US. Is that true? Did I read that somewhere?

Bill Dippel (50:13.518)
Hmm. I don't know that. I actually don't know that stat. I'd have to look. Yeah. Well, that...

Sarah Collins (50:15.288)
I think it's one of the most common themes. I also know it tends to higher index in students, so people who are in school higher index on Achiever because you are having to do so much. Sometimes, so if you are in high school or college and you've taken this assessment, you might see Achiever higher than it would maybe be after you take it when you've been in the working world for a while.

Bill Dippel (50:39.544)
Yeah, well given that it's that high clearly it's overhyped. I think that's the debate It's over, you know clearly overhyped since it's so high so I like it and and token responding to one of our commenters Do you do? How do you feel about taking a moment to celebrate a win? Something you struggle with or something pretty easy for you to do

Sarah Collins (50:45.976)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Token Barnthouse (51:03.059)
Easy for me now. In the trenches earlier in my professional career, I would say that I never stopped for that. I was like, To check in a box along a path towards a bigger thing. And what is that bigger thing? When is it enough? When will I pause and say, that was pretty awesome.

Bill Dippel (51:31.982)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (51:32.068)
Yeah, yeah.

Token Barnthouse (51:32.911)
Now, no problem. Yeah, it's a good thing. Now I'll take that moment. It's like, you just did something great. Or just for myself internally, like, you know what? I'm pretty proud of myself for pausing or maybe saying, you know, I'm not going to take this one. I just, need a day. I need a couple of days. I need...

Bill Dippel (51:35.35)
Now I'll take a moment. Take a drive. Get a good. Yeah. Yeah.

Sarah Collins (51:55.832)
Yeah. And it sounds like that's a learned skill for you, being able to celebrate and take the time. It wasn't natural. You know, I think some people who have certain strengths, it's more natural. As positivity, I naturally celebrate. I love that. I want to celebrate literally everything. But that's not one of your top themes. And you have that achiever pushing you. So it was like, we can say, OK, we know celebration is important. Some of us are going to do that more naturally, and some of us are going to have to learn how to do it.

Token Barnthouse (51:56.147)
Yeah, you got.

Token Barnthouse (52:00.905)
Show in.

Sarah Collins (52:23.788)
And that's okay. And I think that's something to think about that there are skills out there or just best practices for us as human beings, us as workers, us in corporate America, that we have to say, okay, this doesn't come naturally to me. So how can I learn how to do it based on the themes I have? How can I partner with people who do do it and let them influence me a little bit more? And that's where, you know, we get

really powerful teams is when we let each other have the influence of those best practices, whether or not it comes naturally to us.

Token Barnthouse (52:56.863)
That takes work. I'll just say that. It takes a lot of work. And you can't take the defeats to heart too much. can't, like, again, on the achiever side, it's like, hey, we really tried to do this and it just fell flat on its face. Okay, try something different. Try something new. We generally, in the corporate culture, just in our daily grind, we have to pause and celebrate those successes.

Sarah Collins (53:24.46)
Absolutely. So tell us token, when have your strengths been in firework moments, successes, shines? When does it help you really sparkle to your fullest?

Token Barnthouse (53:31.517)
One.

Token Barnthouse (53:36.383)
They, I've had those moments, Sarah, when, when I've been surrounded by a like-minded supportive team, be that supervisor superiors and a support team and a support group of peers. Yeah. And that's just like successful community events. So when I was working for the Navy overseas, did a lot of community events, like 4th of July. Italy doesn't celebrate the 4th of July. do. So.

Putting on large fourth of July type celebrations for communities that really appreciate it. you, you are, boy, you're grinding through planning on that for a month and a couple of days events or it's just kicking your butt. And at the end of it, you'll, you'll get that. Thank you. Or you'll just get the high five or you're just like, wow. For me, that was important because I was that military kid growing up overseas and to be a professional providing that to see kids who were me.

And to provide that those are like when my why was in check with the effort in place and the balance was there. That's when the fireworks go on and that that is translated into projects here at the food bank and getting engaged, getting more engaged in the community of Reno and sparks in northern Nevada. I'm also very involved with scouting America. I'm a local leader.

Sarah Collins (54:36.506)
Mm-hmm.

Token Barnthouse (55:01.151)
with volunteering and working in different communities in Northern California and Nevada. So connecting people, my connectedness on fire. So, and working to get communities and resources connected. That's, find a lot of joy there.

Sarah Collins (55:10.788)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (55:19.012)
Wow, you can hear your why in there so strong. I love to hear that firework moment when those strengths are in alignment with your why and the people around you are supporting it and recognizing it. That's really, really cool. Unfortunately, we have to ask you about your dumpster fire. When do you find yourself in a dumpster fire?

Bill Dippel (55:22.2)
Yeah.

Token Barnthouse (55:31.411)
Thank

Bill Dippel (55:34.134)
Yeah. Yeah. When's the bad one? Hit us.

Token Barnthouse (55:35.247)
my gosh. When the achiever takes over and I'm not being smart about it and you know when physical health gets challenged, when emotional mental health isn't kept in check, when you know when I'm that guy who comes home and is like it's I'm a different person like well okay it's just great at work and come home you're like whoa.

Sarah Collins (55:44.73)
Hmm.

Token Barnthouse (56:03.485)
Wow, where did that comment or stress come from? Where was that? So when things get out of check, for sure.

Sarah Collins (56:03.577)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (56:10.018)
Yeah, you bring up such a valuable point of like what happens to achievers when they can't do so much? How do they still feel valuable?

Token Barnthouse (56:19.571)
Yeah, that's a real thing. I will admit that. When I changed my career, 18 years growing up as a military brat, 22 years as a career, the only break I took was to go to undergrad and grad school. That was it. That was the environment. I was grinding. You're like, whoa, now what? Who am I? What am I doing? Deep philosophical questions.

Sarah Collins (56:20.878)
I mean, cause that's a real thing, right?

Sarah Collins (56:36.356)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (56:44.696)
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And it's, and I think it can be really hard, like whether it's the demands of life change for a reason, or you've, you, you'd mentioned like health, if you suffer a physical, issue where you can't perform, right? Like that I think really puts into check those achievers who have been running, running, running when something happens that says, Hey, you can't.

be checking things off the list today because physically you cannot do it for some reason. Then I think we have our achiever stop to go, what is my why? What are these other strengths I have? Right? And sometimes, sometimes maybe a little beauty in that because it forces you to do it. But I think it can be really hard in the moment. Like you're talking about token of like, what's my purpose if it's not just to check all these things off the list?

Any advice for people who are achievers who feel like they are trapped in the hamster wheel of checking things off their list?

Token Barnthouse (57:51.699)
Check your Y.

Bill Dippel (57:54.927)
Check your why. Yeah, it's well said. Check your why. Know why you're doing it. And let's think about accomplishment instead of achieving. What is the accomplishment we want to get rather than, which I took down as one of my great notes for today.

Sarah Collins (57:57.38)
There you go. I love it.

Bill Dippel (58:10.584)
Well, Token, I again, we are really, really glad you came on with us today to share your achiever to talk about what it is. I think we've come to the debate and where we it's it's overhyped. No, it's OK. It might be overhyped in certain situations, but I think we've we've hit a we've hit a mark where I feel.

And Sarah and I, you and I bounce that around with each other on sometimes it can feel overhyped. Sometimes we see it so frequently it might it might be hyped. We got to look for burnout and we got to get people off the hamster wheel. So in that, I feel like we've we've come around on that. So well, token, thank you so much for coming on with us today.

Token Barnthouse (58:53.887)
Thank you, Bill and Sarah for having me. I was humbled to be asked and I love talking about this. think strengths and knowing yourself and knowing how these 34 themes interact with one another are wonderful. I really do. They really lay things out and get you to know yourself better and help those around you too. Love you.

Sarah Collins (58:53.946)
Yeah.

Bill Dippel (59:08.142)
Yeah.

Sarah Collins (59:08.302)
Yeah.

Bill Dippel (59:15.714)
Yeah, and I'm really grateful you're part of the community at FBNN because it makes my job so much easier knowing I have a really strong Backboned ambassador that can come in and make the difference and seize the value in what we do. So thank you for that That does make that tough. So Awesome. Well, thank you so much as always. We're really grateful our ambassadors are Arsonists all of the people that come and help us do the show. So with that we will talk soon

Sarah Collins (59:16.409)
Yeah.

Token Barnthouse (59:40.959)
Thank

Sarah Collins (59:45.21)
Bye.